|
|
Post by doctariusa on Feb 8, 2006 18:52:48 GMT -5
I own a 2000 Kia sportage. 109,000 miles. Automatic 4x4. At times the brake petal tightens the more I use the
brakes, to the point where both front brakes tighten until it can
hardly be driven. I've had to wait on the side of the road until, with
time, the pressurization releases on it's own and it's back to
normal. This repeats gradually over days.
I had the same problem exactly one year ago. I went to a Kia dealer.
After $950 they replaced the pads, calipers, front brake lines, and
master cylinder (everything except the slave cylinders). I had no
further problems until a couple weeks ago, when it started again I
really don't want to spend other $950, for something that may not
require a near total front system replacement. Has anyone had a
simular problem? What is it?
|
|
|
|
Post by DanD on Feb 9, 2006 7:51:02 GMT -5
For this to happen a second time I’m thinking contaminated brake fluid. How or what has contaminated the fluid who knows and maybe whatever it was the first time was not completely flushed out and has taken this long to damage the rubber components of the system. You never know maybe someone has inadvertently toped the master cylinder with the wrong fluid again; it calls for DOT 3 brake fluid.
Even the slightest amount of a petroleum product will cause the rubbers used in a brake system to swell. Combined that with the heat generated by normal braking and wheels will start to hold tight or worse yet cause something to blow leaving you with no brakes.
Did the dealer tell you what they thought the cause was the first time? This does not just happen from wear and tare something has caused it.
If it was contamination I would be going back to them and asking why they didn’t replace the rear wheel cylinders and the rear flex hose. The rears may not have shown any problems at that time but it’s a closed system that uses the same reservoir. Again if it is/was contaminated fluid it will circulate throughout the system.
I maybe barking up the wrong tree here but I looked through the service bulletins for the vehicle and there’s nothing (I have anyway) for the brakes.
Meaning that if it were a common mechanical problem with other Kia’s it would be listed.
Dan.
|
|
|
|
Post by doctariusa on Feb 9, 2006 18:15:57 GMT -5
The Kia dealor said the calipers were bad. Also, they said it was best to replace the lines; that they showed some signs of deterioration They called before I was to pick it up and said when they tried the new calipers they could not get the brakes to pump and told me I needed a new master cyclinder. As far as I am aware, no brake fluid has been added since then. Both front wheels were extremely hot when this occured and the brake petal pressurized to the point there was very little play. When I told the Kia Dealor they did not say it was a usual problem that they hear.
|
|
|
|
Post by DanD on Feb 9, 2006 20:07:02 GMT -5
I would really like to know what the outcome for this is and I would love to get my hands on your vehicle just for the learning experience.
I don’t think it’s a mechanical problem as in a pedal height adjustment, it could possibly be an ABS or Traction control issue but I’m still stuck thinking fluid contamination.
Let us know what happens, I’m very interested.
Dan.
|
|
|
|
Post by way2old on Feb 10, 2006 7:46:08 GMT -5
An off the wall thought--wonder if the brake pedal rod has an adjustment on the end and it is adjusted wrong. had some of our Vics do that years ago. Again, it is just a left field idea. Not familiar with your car at all.
|
|
|
|
Post by DanD on Feb 10, 2006 12:49:05 GMT -5
It’s well worth a check of the pedal adjustment. The more I think about this strange deal could it be that the brake booster is applying the brake due to a bad internal vacuum valve. doctariusa can you hear a very quite hissing/vacuum sound from under the dash near your feet; right after shutting the vehicle off? Dan.  |
|
|
|
Post by re-tired on Feb 10, 2006 22:25:16 GMT -5
this happen to me once,so ive got to ask ,doc your not a two foot driver are you?
|
|
|
|
Post by doctariusa on Feb 11, 2006 9:30:52 GMT -5
No hissing/vacumm sound under the dash. When I cut the car off, there is a click sound coming from the automactic shifter area. And no, I'm not a two foot driver. The problem is very real and frustrating to me. The problem comes and goes with no pattern of time. I'd rather have it just happen and stay that way, so a mechanic can have that to work. It may go for weeks, then do it. By the time I get it to the garage, it's back to OK again. What I don't what is another $950 bill unless it's necessary. I've had more then one person say pushrod or something to do with it. Also, for me not to attempt adjusting that myself, but go to a mechanic. It make sense to me that something is holding pressure on both front lines and keeping the petal tight. What is frustrating it will fix it's self on its own. Then go for some time before it happens again.
|
|
|
|
Post by re-tired on Feb 11, 2006 13:38:14 GMT -5
Please understand that I am not implying anything about your driving habits or that we do not think the problem is real.All the guys on this forum take great pride in their ability to fix people's cars without seeing or hearing them and ask nothing in return . It's based mostly on past experience of similar problems and a knowledge of systems. I actually had a car that had been to numerous shops ,hundreds of dollars spent and all it was is the guy letting his foot rest on the brake pedal ,therefore my question to you. Please bear with us and the guys will help all they can. Sorry to be so long , but I sensed your frustration level was rising ,hang in there.
|
|
|
|
Post by doctariusa on Feb 13, 2006 16:57:20 GMT -5
I do appreciate your responses. It happened again this afternoon on my way back from work. This was first time since I first posted. Everything was normal for a few miles, when then it felt very similar to a dirty fuel filter bogging down the engine. I touched the brake petal and it was hard with no play. I pulled off the road and felt the front chrome wheels. Both were extremely hot. The back wheels were cool. I started back slowly trying to get home, when after a minute the bogging down suddenly stopped and I could resume regular speed. I touched the brake petal and it now had the normal play in it that you would expect. The car will be paid off in June. I was hoping not to have to spend another $1,000 dollars on this problem again. It must have been hit when it was worked on last year, to not a have another problem until now. I don't know why it happened again now. It's seems like calipers or a master cylinder should last longer than that. It will not be long before I'm going to have to put it in a shop. I'm not going back to the KIA Dealer. I have an independent certified mechanic company not far from me. I'll try him.
|
|
|
|
Post by DanD on Feb 13, 2006 19:29:46 GMT -5
Just reading your last response doc; I’m starting wonder if this is a brake problem at all. You keep saying that the brake pedal gets hard and you can’t drive any further; is this because the engine is running out of sorts causing a lack of power?
An engine running weak will not produce sufficient vacuum to give you a “normal” feeling brake pedal. It is also normal that the front hubs feel warm to the touch, not hot to burn but defiantly warm compared to the rear hubs.
Just a thought.
Dan.
|
|
|
|
Post by re-tired on Feb 14, 2006 1:43:31 GMT -5
I agree with dan. one thing you can do is a process of elimination. One thought being nocked around is the brake booster somehow applyihg pressure to activate brakes , only front are getting hot because rear shoes are not set tight. Find a low traffic road, disconnect the booster vac hose and plug off. drive very carefully you will have no power assist. Try to do when brakes are acting up . see if drag goes away.If you end up at shop please us know what they find.
|
|
|
|
Post by doctariusa on Feb 14, 2006 19:02:53 GMT -5
I put it in the shop tonight. They will look at it tomorrow. The mechanic at the desk said it sounded like the calipers and/or faulty brake line. I told him KIA replaced both about a year ago, as well as the Master, when an identical problem occurred, and the problem was gone until recently. The owner came by and said it might be a master cylinder adjustment. I'm hoping with him. When this happens both front rotors are "blistering" hot, and the chrome wheels are covered with graphite dust. I asked about the odds of both calipers sticking at the same time. I guess it could happen. One thing I have not written before is that when this happens the brake has twice remained hard even when the car was off. Once I could not even depress it enough for it to engage the safety switch to be able to turn the key. After I waited a few minutes, the brake petal was OK and I could start the car. I'll let you guys know the results when I get them. I hope it's not another $950. I'm happy with this Kia 4x4. Just right for getting home in the snow, and I use it for surf fishing at Assateague National park. Before this, I thought about keeping it and seeing just how many miles a KIA would go before major engine problems occurred. But, now if I’m hit with another expensive brake bill after just a year, I’m seriously thinking about trading or selling as soon as I pay this one off in June.
|
|
|
|
Post by DanD on Feb 14, 2006 20:30:28 GMT -5
Let us know what they find and please get as much info from the shop as possible to post for us. This trade is a non stop learning curve and I'm hoping to gain from your experience.
Dan.
|
|
|
|
Post by doctariusa on Feb 15, 2006 17:20:31 GMT -5
:)Fixed. Master brake cylinder problem is what I told. They put a new one on. I am so happy, I told them to keep it in and put on a new timing belt I had been putting off getting done. It's suggested to change at 100,000 miles. I think I'll see how many miles this KIA will do after all. I really do appreciate all of you and your responses. It's nice to know there is forum to ask these questions of professionals. I'll see if I can get more information on the fine details when I pick it up Friday.
|
|
